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congrats to wong for the 3 peat, and to torpedoes for second and GC for 3rd...I'm just getting started here
All Proofs on
October 4, 2021 8:33 AM
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Congratulations to Wong, well done!
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Thanks, GC. The rest of you really made me earn it this season. It was a pleasure competing with you.
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Good season all and big congrats to Wong on a dominant performance. This was my first year in the league but if I'm reading the historical standings correctly, it looks like this is a three-peat? Super impressive. Will try to make you work a little harder for it next year!
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There's one person hurling insults/expletives/taunts/trolls at other guys in the league and hot to make spite trades to so yeah, its everyone else's fault
Carver High on
July 12, 2021 11:51 AM
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Lol get a life yourself masterbatters. You’re the bad apple here
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More trades to come too. Prick has about ten more injured players to unload in absurd trades.
Las Piranhas on
July 12, 2021 1:21 AM
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It’s a freaking fantasy baseball league for crying out loud. Good grief!
Las Piranhas on
July 12, 2021 1:16 AM
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In short, you’ll never stop a little bitch being a little bitch! Imagine the two biggest drama queens posting again to argue and debate any topic. You guys really need to get laid or something. Get a life seriously! I don’t think I’ve ever seen anyone argue, debate, disagree, or complicate issues more than you guys. Drama, drama, drama!
Las Piranhas on
July 12, 2021 1:13 AM
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In short, you’ll never stop a little bitch being a little bitch! Imagine the two biggest drama queens posting again to argue and debate any topic. You guys really need to get laid or something. Get a life seriously! I don’t think I’ve ever seen anyone argue, debate, disagree, or complicate issues more than you guys. Drama, drama, drama!
Las Piranhas on
July 12, 2021 1:13 AM
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I'd love to incorporate a 5 (or 10) MILB structure into the league if others are interested. Also open-minded to the idea of a reasonable arbitration coupon system. But, have to agree with GC that addressing toxic name calling and other personal conduct issues is an entirely separate topic and will not be resolved by implementing these types of incentive structures.
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All that said, these rule changes are not a panacea. You’re ascribing far too much power to incentives and not enough to people. Incentive structures don't “eliminate toxic name calling” and they also don’t prompt one owner to call another a "little bitch" on a message board – people do that. They also don’t turn less competitive owners into more competitive ones. There is simply no substitute for talented (and tolerable) owners. I’m all for putting these measures to a vote though.
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Trey Baughn’s article proposes three measures, and I’d be open to all three of them. The first is a meaningful buy-in, which we already have (although if anyone wants to bump it up to $250, I would be very supportive). The second is an MILB draft – I already play in one Ottoneu league that has a similar concept, and I like it a lot. The third is arbitration coupons, which I’ve never heard of but am completely fine with conceptually.
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In terms of the links, I think there are some good ideas here. I am against rule changes that would substantially curtail present value for future value swaps, but I don’t think any of these proposals would do that. They would just give rebuilding owners more to think about when selling, and more levers to pull as they pursue their rebuild.
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Could not disagree more on the suggestion that emulating a real-life GM experience would be “woefully misguided”. Your argument doesn’t hold any water. If tanking were damaging MLB’s popularity, would the situation not be far worse for the NFL and NBA, leagues with much stronger incentives to tank? The popularity decline has more to do with poor marketing, poor leadership, longer/slower games not well suited to TV, and a CBA that discourages teams from putting their best product on the field.
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https://community.ottoneu.com/t/ottoneu-custom-leagues/381
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https://community.ottoneu.com/t/coupons-a-success-in-league-649/629
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https://community.ottoneu.com/search?q=arbitration%20coupons
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https://fantasy.fangraphs.com/ottoneu-101-the-5milb-structure/
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https://fantasy.fangraphs.com/designing-league-incentives/
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Rather than continuing this unproductive exercise of trying to one-up each other with a better insult or sarcastic reply, I respectfully implore each of you to check out the following links when you have some time to give this situation proper productive consideration.
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Any assertion that the current format is “good because it emulates the current MLB environment” is woefully misguided. There is a reason that MLB’s popularity among sports fans is at an all-time low, and the widespread blatant tanking is a big part of it. A format that rewards teams for every place higher in the standings they finish will naturally compel even “rebuilding” teams to ensure they are making “fair” deals that properly balance the future with the present.
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Please do not confuse my playing by the current rules as a competitor with my belief that there is a better way to encourage optimal competition and engagement. Most importantly, a well designed incentive structure will naturally be self-policing and will eliminate the toxic name calling and finger pointing that arises from varying perspectives of a fellow competitor’s motivations or resolution.
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Average salaries aren’t too relevant when not every player is up for auction every year. Low ownership rates are relevant in that they tell you when players are widely viewed as not worth rostering at any price. I know these nuances are not incredibly helpful when one’s primary focus is trolling fellow owners, but thought I’d clarify nonetheless as my comments seem to have been misunderstood.
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Nah, Devers average salary is $27. And due to the respect of the wisdom of the Ottoneu crowd, he’s overpriced. Kinda like Puk and Frazier no longer have value due to the wisdom of the Ottoneu crowd. It’s pretty straightforward.
Las Piranhas on
July 10, 2021 11:58 AM
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Apparently, you misread my post. I was just reacting in astonishment that the two most vocal critics of prospects for stars trades just got together for such a deal. As I said in my post, I'm glad to see you've come around on the concept. I never said anything about collusion. And I'm sure there was no intent to spite those complaining pricks that vetoed your trade a few days ago. Best of luck with the rebuild. Tough to let go of a $31 Devers, but Abrams and Brujan are nice pieces to have.
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This trade is pretty much identical to the trades you’ve made. What’s the problem then. I gotta say it will certainly makes things interesting as the season plays out. Love the fairness and competitive balance in other teams able to overcome and keep up with the other absurd trades made. I value my return so much. Gotta pay the price to get top tier prospects.
Las Piranhas on
July 10, 2021 3:36 AM
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Surely you aren’t scared of fair competitive competition. Evidently it’s only okay if it works in your favor. I don’t know Torpedoes, no collusion here, I’m building for next season. Value both players I’m getting tremendously. Look at the stolen bases I’ll have in the future. I’m only interested in making my team better. And there’s a price to pay for young talent. You guys have set that standard with the veto of my previous trade. Which way do you want. Can’t have it all your way.
Las Piranhas on
July 10, 2021 3:19 AM
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This is not a dump trade. As a matter of fact it is pretty much identical to your Mike Trout trade. I am not winning this year. So I’m planning for next year. Not a dump trade. The players involved are owned in more than 98% of Ottoneu leagues. That’s the basis for trades according to other folks in the league. What’s wrong Czech, you worried that all your trading away injured damaged goods players for top tier players is gonna prevent you from running away with the trophy.
Las Piranhas on
July 10, 2021 3:14 AM
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Hey, look! It's the two guys that are adamantly against "dump" trades engaging in the biggest dump trade I've seen yet. Good stuff! Glad to see you've come around on the concept that trading present value for future value can be mutually beneficial.
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LOL. If I were using a scouting scale I’d give this post a 20 for self-awareness. Good luck this season MB.
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Yep GC, you are correct I am not an owner that bitched about any of that. I did however ask if I could make cuts because I made an honest mistake. I do believe I even stated I don’t have time for a bunch of drama in a fantasy baseball league. That’s the opposite of bitching. That’s actually saying chill the fuck out and get a life. You however have argued and debated pretty much every post you’ve made. That is a description of a little bitch. Over fucking fantasy baseball. Get a life dude
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MB - just to be clear, are you not the same owner who bitched incessantly after not making offseason cuts in time, and then again after losing a coin flip waiver claim? Just asking as one of the “complaining pricks” you referenced. Cheers!
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Got it commish - doubt we’ll agree on this one but I respect the point of view, and I’m just one league member out of twelve. Certainly open to hearing what others think.
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Also there appears to be multiple lopsided trades made with same trading parties. Seems suspect to me. Especially when the trades are the top tier fantasy players being traded for damaged goods injured players.
Las Piranhas on
July 9, 2021 12:27 AM
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If you voted veto on the trade Killer and I made, then I expect you to be consistent and veto the Trout trade as well.
Las Piranhas on
July 9, 2021 12:23 AM
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If the Trout trade doesn’t get vetoed, then we have a bunch of hypocrites in the league. Honestly, I’ve never been in a worse group of complaining pricks like some in this group. Puk and Frazier have just as much value as Franco based on his poor production so far. If Frazier’s last years numbers are devalued due to a bad start this year. Franco awful numbers so far devalue his potential as well. Hell even if you want to consider his potential, it’s not worthy of those three players sent.
Las Piranhas on
July 9, 2021 12:13 AM
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With all due respect, GC, I vehemently disagree with any assertion that "integrity" can coincide with "tanking." That's just not what the spirit of COMPETITION is about. As for Ottoneu, I agree that it is pretty darn good. I am commissioner of this league because the previous one literally disappeared without warning and I stepped up to fill the void. I also hoped I could make it a better, more challenging fantasy competition. Instead, we are left with inane debates such as t
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I (and I assume most people playing Ottoneu) love it because of how closely it mirrors real life - the relative value judgments and the present vs future considerations mirror those of a real GM. The rules might not be everyone’s cup of tea, but I think it’s the best set of rules I’ve ever played with, and I’ve played lots of fantasy leagues. It seems odd that you’d want to be commissioner of an Ottoneu league if you don’t like the Ottoneu rules / incentive structure.
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“Integrity of competition” is not synonymous with “rules that incentivize everyone to compete in the current year”. You can have either without the other. There’s nothing wrong with wanting both, but it’s not my preference.
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When the majority of this group is ready to discuss making “integrity of competition” a leaguewide policy, then we can engage in a productive discussion. Until then, this is all just bluster.
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The fact that it’s a dynasty league should not change that fact. There’s plenty of talent available in auction every year to turn one’s fortunes around if done properly without needing to engage in dum(b)p trades. If it’s a fantasy COMPETITION, there should be incentive to COMPETE. Every day. Every season. It’s elementary.
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The lack of incentive for all of us to keep competing to some degree literally sows the seeds for this current spat. Rather than this inane bickering back-and-forth over perceived valuations, the only legitimate answer is a simple self-policing structure that rewards teams for every place in the standings—EVERY YEAR. Finishing fourth should be better than finishing fifth. Finishing 9th should be better than 10th, and finishing dead last should SUCK!
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The idea that it is somehow “good” for a team to disregard the current season and go into the tank, dumping useful current assets onto a competitor in exchange for prospective “futures” in hopes of a better tomorrow is absurd. Every team should have incentive to keep competing in the current season as best they can, even as WE ALL keep one eye on the future. Traditional Ottoneu is fatally flawed in this regard, especially in today’s woefully misguided win-it-all-or-tank environment.
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Any argument that the “prospect” one tanker is trading for should be held in higher esteem than the “suspect” of another tanker’s affection is just semantics. It is no different than a boxer taking a dive. He may be doing it for the long-term betterment of his health, but that does not boost the integrity of the boxing match in question. Such is the corrupt affliction that has infected most “dynasty” leagues, Ottoneu in particular.
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As commissioner of this league, please allow me to weigh in on the recent kerfuffle. I tried to address this conundrum a couple years ago and was literally booed off the stage. To repeat the obvious, as soon as any competition encourages (ala MLB) or even permits blindly “throwing in the towel” on the current season without consequence, any concept of “integrity” most certainly must be called into question. How can anyone prove the motives of a tanking team are somehow “pure”?
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Like i said its my mistake for the choice of words..
So its over and done with. Just gonna move forward
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If you just defended the trade initially and didn't post that you made the trade to "make the other team better" (I'm paraphrasing here), I don't think anyone would've had an issue with it. I think it's really that simple.
Strick9 on
July 8, 2021 6:10 PM
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We should be able to manage our teams as we wish and make trades as we please.. In no way would i want to cheat just to let some one win.
I just dont think you should punish masterbaters for the trade when this trade is almost the same exact
as the one excepted..
It would be one thing if i knew guys in this league and i traded all my players away.
Maybe my choice of words were not the best.. Ill still mange my team and start my players.. Not going t
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Yeah that is a fair point. I don’t know exactly where to draw the line on this because I do think people should be free to manage their teams as they see fit provided they are competing in good faith, but the response definitely did not inspire confidence. I also hadn’t noticed the trade was already vetoed…I don’t have a problem with that outcome in this particular case.
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